Michigan corn growers, cover crops, and crop insurance: Great Lakes Crop Summit 2020

Shay

Foulk: Hey podcast, thanks for joining us for another episode of the Ag View Pitch. Today's episode features 3 different speakers that we interviewed at the Great Lakes Crop Summit. Chris and I were up here for a speaking event, had a phenomenal time. Huge event, putting it on with a lot of great resources and definitely something to check out if you're within driving distance or have any interest in what's going on in the Michigan region around the Great Lakes. So definitely something to look into. Highly recommend it. Hope you enjoy the podcast today. Again, some phenomenal speakers.

Matt

Frostek: Enjoy.

Shay

Foulk: Welcome back, everyone, to another episode of the Ag View Pitch. And we're joined here today with special guest Matt Frostek. How's it going today, Matt? Real good. Hey, appreciate you taking the time to talk with us. And I was wondering if you can just give a little bit of background on, you know, what you do, what your role is, and you know, why we're here today.

Matt

Frostek: So I am the current president of the Michigan Corn Growers Association, and every year we put what they call the Great Lakes Crop Summit together, and we've kind of modeled it off of the national event, the Commodity Classic, where we bring in speakers from around the region, around the area, different areas and different colleges to speak about things that are currently what we deal with in agriculture today. So This is our 7th year we've done it, and every year we've sold out. So it's been a really successful event.

Shay

Foulk: And I didn't know what to expect. I haven't been here in the prior years, you know, here with Chris Barron for speaking. And I walked in and I was just blown away at the size of the room and the number of attendees. And, you know, talking with Jim Zook here, he was saying, you know, we're pretty well maxed out. I mean, it's huge at this facility, and maybe there's room for growth there looking at going elsewhere.

Unknown: But I think this has been a hugely successful event, right?

Matt

Frostek: Right? It really has. We— this is the 6th year we've had it here. We kind of outgrew the first facility, and there's really only a couple other facilities in the state that we could go to that, you know, if we really ramped up to go higher. But, you know, Mount Pleasant is a great place because it's centrally located, it's easy to get to, and I feel sometimes that makes it popular because, you know, guys from the rural areas are pretty willing to come this far to this area. So it works out.

Shay

Foulk: Oh, that's great.

Unknown: And then, you know, just looking at the old overall purpose, you said MCGA puts on the event.

Shay

Foulk: How did you get into the position that you are there with the Corn Growers and what does that look like moving forward for you?

Matt

Frostek: So I was elected onto the Corn Growers about 8 years ago. I'm serving my last term right now as, and I currently am the president. It's been a fun ride. The Corn Growers has evolved, the Michigan Corn Growers has evolved over the past 8 years. Our executive director Jim Zook has challenged our board to do things that, you know, maybe we weren't comfortable doing, but it's been a positive move forward. Our goal is to be more relevant to our industry, especially in the state of Michigan, and that could mean going to Washington, D.C. to speak and fight for policy, or it could mean taking a trip to China or Japan and trying to open up markets for corn. So it certainly has been challenging, but a fun experience too.

Shay

Foulk: And so for some of those who don't understand, how is the, you know, Michigan Corn Growers Association different from the Iowa, Illinois, Dakotas? You know, just looking at how corn is represented in the state and the impact that you can make on the farmers that are attending events like this today, you know, what are some key differences there and where do you see it going moving forward?

Matt

Frostek: So Michigan is, we're not the, obviously not the biggest producer of corn. But we're very relevant in our representation in D.C. with Senator Stabenow. So we have a real key influence on agriculture and policy. And so there's some pretty good responsibility to that. So Michigan really has, if you kind of delve into what we do nationally, we're one of the major players and influencers on policy because we have just the nature of where we're at with representation. And I feel also it's been, you know, the board moving forward and taking those steps to be relevant too.

Shay

Foulk: No, that's great. You know, anything else that you want to touch on here just with the summit and everything that's going on? Obviously there's another day here tomorrow. You know, any other comments here on the summit?

Matt

Frostek: Yeah, I mean, this, this is a great event to, you know, personally for someone to, to ramp up their skills in agriculture or see what's ahead, what the future holds. Sometimes it's just good to get out and see that other farmers are having the same struggles you are, and maybe they've got a few answers that might apply to your life. So it's about meeting people, and it's about learning from speakers and what's headed in the future too.

Shay

Foulk: And I'm sure everyone that's listening can hear in the background all the murmuring and the talking going on, which is phenomenal. And I think that's where a lot of the true value comes out of the events. Networking is almost 80% of it, Definitely a great lineup of speakers here and, you know, just really excited for the event. I've been here for 3 hours and I know with confidence that I would definitely recommend this to anybody in the area that can make the trip. So Matt, hey, really appreciate the time here this morning. Thank you very much.

Matt

Frostek: Thank you. Appreciate it too.

Shay

Foulk: And for everyone listening, we will catch you next time on the Ag View Pitch. Welcome back everyone to another episode of the Ag View Pitch. And we're joined here today at the Great Lakes Crop Summit with John Burke. How's it going today, John?

Unknown: Very good. Thank you, Shea.

Shay

Foulk: Yeah, I appreciate you taking the time to talk with us here, and as I understand it, you're going to be talking on cover crops, and you do a lot of work in that area. Can you just give us a little background on what it is that you do and why you're speaking here today?

Unknown: Well, a little bit of what I do is I started out as actually an extension educator for MSU for a lot of years, and then I just went back to the family farm, and we were looking at our soils as being depleted and things weren't growing well, so we've been doing cover crops for about 20 years now, and we started out with something simple, oilseed radish. Germinates real easily, it winter kills, it's not a big deal. From there we graduated to trying to use a lot of cereal rye, we're using a lot of spring barley, we're using some clover, a lot of winter peas we're using now mixed with our radishes, trying to use that as a nitrogen source for the radishes to grow a little better.

Shay

Foulk: There's a lot of confusion with COVID crops and I think people really get overwhelmed because some, they just wanna plant cereal rye and wanna have the COVID and take advantage of some of the programs and then there's other people that are really looking at building up your fertility and nutrition and everything that goes along with that.

Unknown: And some of the blends can get confusing.

Shay

Foulk: You see guys that are planting 16, 17-way mixes. What are your thoughts on that and some of the confusion that's out there in the industry?

Unknown: Well, the 16-way mixes, like you were talking about, I used to try and do a 3 and 4-way mix sometimes and we just dropped it back to 2. To me, it's confusing and I don't know what the big benefit is of having 16 things in the mix. Because what's gonna happen is, You, for us for instance, we're trying to get rid of nematodes in the soil for our sugar beet cyst. So you want the radish roots close together. So if I start going with a 16-way mix, I'm going to be reducing the amount of pounds of radish I'm putting out there because now I'm going to have 3 pounds of sunflowers, I might have a couple pounds of turnips in that mix. So now I'm depleting the nematode reduction that I'm trying to accomplish because now I got less radishes in the mix. So I think a lot of it is It's very site-specific to your own field.

Every field is different and it's what are you trying to accomplish with that field? And I think that's why we end up with a lot of these mixes sometimes. And then sometimes I always wonder, are we doing these mixes just because we like to make things confusing? And do they actually really work?

Shay

Foulk: No, I think that's a great point. And so let's talk on radishes for a minute. 'Cause I just saw a picture, I think it was on Twitter of a farmer down in Georgia and he had radishes that were the size of his legs that he was pulling out of the ground there. So, you know, definitely looking at, you know, people look at some of the compaction reduction that you can have in that and some of the soil airability, and there's a lot of benefits there. I know radishes scare some people though. What are your thoughts there?

Unknown: Well, the problem with the radish is those roots do go very deep. And we've had, not on our farm, but there's been farms in the area, and I've heard of this down in Indiana where folks have problems with the radish roots getting into the field tile. There's some growers in our area that have said, "We'd much rather fix tile than have poor soils." There's other growers, "We don't like fixing tile, we'll just stop using the radish." I haven't had that issue yet, but then we plant our radishes a little bit later in the year into the, or I should say in the late summer months, early fall, and we can winter kill before them roots get into the tile a lot of times to keep them out. So that's why we're not getting that problem with the tile breaking on us.

Shay

Foulk: Yeah, I know that's big on some people's minds. And I think it depends on how your soil structure is, where you are. You know, we were here working with some growers in Michigan yesterday And they're like, well, we don't know what, you know, that deep A horizon looks like. We don't have that here. Whereas in Iowa, you could have 3, 4, 50 feet of topsoil, you know, and it makes a lot of difference when you look at some of those cover decisions.

Unknown: Well, and it does. See, like here, our topsoil is only 8, 9 inches deep. And then we hit a clay layer. That's our hardpan. So it's very difficult anyway for us to get a radish root to go 5, 6 feet in the ground. Like, you know, you go in the Illinois and the Indianas where you've got a whole 4 feet of topsoil. It's really loose, it's real friable, that taproot can go down. Here in Michigan, we don't get that as much. It's very difficult.

Shay

Foulk: So let's look a little bit here quickly at, you know, people talk a lot about the, you know, very obvious benefits. You have improved aeration, you're saving some of your nutrients, you're reducing runoff. But there's also advantages with tons of programs out there. You know, the CSP, the EQUIP programs, there's a lot going on there. Where do you think producers in this area and then kind of throughout the Midwest here see the most value in cover crops from your experience? And how do you think that we can improve that moving forward?

Unknown: Well, a lot of the improvements or the biggest benefit here in our area is the runoff of the water into the bay. We're having a lot of phosphorus issues going into the Saginaw Bay. Along with that, you get the algae growth. So we're trying to prevent that. So the COVID crops help with that. The other big issue we have in this area is wind erosion. So a lot of, you know, we used to, we do grow a lot of dry beans, a lot of pickles, a lot of sugar beets. So when you're done harvesting, there's nothing on the soil. So it just blows, it just runs off when it rains. So that's where the biggest benefits of the COVID crops are coming is more for keeping the soil in place in our area. Also with those crops, when I say crops as far as sugar beets and pickles, it's very, a lot of compaction from the harvesting equipment. Radish roots help break that up.

So do the, so does cereal rye help break that compaction up. And the reason we use a lot of cereal rye is we get so late harvesting here in Michigan, it gets to be late in the year, you can't hardly get the rye to germinate, so you're not going to get a radish to grow to do anything of any value. So that's the other option. So we use that as an option to help break up the compaction, add a little more organic matter to the soil, and at the same time, it does germinate enough in the fall where you can get a little bit growing. It'll keep the dirt from blowing through the winter and retain some of that soil from blowing off the soil as well.

Shay

Foulk: Now, those are all great points, and I appreciate you hitting on some of the water quality there. I actually just did another podcast this morning, look at the Water of the United States ruling and how that's recently been affected. I think it's huge at the state level and some of the initiatives by private industry as well to try and curtail this up front because we don't want to be super regulated. We don't want to have, you know, huge disadvantages to farmers based on our production practices. So to be able to mitigate that up front, reduce that runoff, especially in areas like you're talking about here with the bay, of, you know, the huge impacts that it can have on marine life as well.

Unknown: Yes, and the one thing we've also seen is our drain officer in one of our counties has actually gone out and he's finding grant money to give to the farmers to actually use cover crops to help reduce some of this pollution into his drainage ditches. Because like he says, it costs me a lot of money if I have to keep cleaning them all the time. So I'd just as soon pay you guys a few dollars to help pay for that seed and have you use that instead.

Shay

Foulk: And that's, you know, we were talking a little bit here offline, those drainage officers, I don't envy that position because they get a lot thrown at them and they end up taking on a lot more than maybe what they had originally thought.

Unknown: And sometimes they do. When you start talking about, you know, the cleaning of a drainage ditch anymore, it's not like it used to be and just go in and clean. Now you get into DEQ permits and things of that nature where now it's an environmental concern because you've got all this soil that's loaded with phosphorus sitting in the bottom of this drainage ditch. What do we do with that now so we don't overload the field we're putting it on and have that leach through into the groundwater? Because now you've got a groundwater issue to worry about as well. And that was the other thing, you know, when you talk about radishes and rye and spring barley or oats or clovers, they all help soak up some of those excess nutrients that are in the soil. So it also not necessarily prevents it from washing away into the the water bodies, it also keeps it out of the groundwater as well.

And we do have a lot of people that do use groundwater here in their drinking supplies.

Shay

Foulk: Right. So a couple more questions here as we wrap up. You know, if you just had one or two things that you wish that more people knew about COVID crops or wish that they would look into, you know, what would that be? What would you talk to the people listening to this podcast right now?

Unknown: Well, what I would say is I know a lot of people get worried when you say cereal rye. Oh, it gets away on us. It's very difficult to control. It's not that hard to control with the Roundup Ready LibertyLink crops we have today. So I really wouldn't Don't let that stop you from using a cover crop thinking it's gonna get out of control. The barley's all winter kill, oats winter kills, radish will winter kill. So there's a lot of different products you can use that you don't necessarily have to kill yourself to get rid of them.

Shay

Foulk: So to wrap up here, you know, at the Great Lakes Crop Summit, I think it's phenomenal to be here and you can hear in the background all the murmurs and the conversation, the networking going on. But I think the one point that you made on this was there's such a variety of things here. It's not just focused on, fertility or plant health or mental health or finances. It's a little bit of everything. And I think that's why there's so many people that attend this. You know, anything else you want to say on the summit?

Unknown: Yeah, I'd just like to say, you know, yes, we are in our 7th year and we've got over 1,000 attendees still after 7 years of this event. And it's because we bring in speakers that are relevant topics that affect everybody's lives today. And that's why we have so many people here learning about the new technology or cover crops or, how to fertilize their crops. Is there a more efficient way to do it? What can we reduce? How can we reduce our usage?

Shay

Foulk: Oh, that's phenomenal. And I know there's a lot of people here that are looking forward to attending your session and just want to thank you and appreciate the time for you taking to do the podcast and also all the work that you're doing in the COVID crop industry. Everybody really appreciates it.

Unknown: Well, thank you, Shay. Enjoyed being here today, and I'm glad you're here. And let's hope everybody has a good time today.

Shay

Foulk: Yeah, thanks again, John, and thank you everyone for listening. We will catch you next time on the Ag View Pitch.

Unknown: Welcome back everyone to another episode of the Ag View Pitch and joined here today with special guest Tara Smith. Thank you so much for joining me here today. Thanks for having me. So again, we're at the Great Lakes Crop Summit and a lot of phenomenal speakers. And Tara, I was wondering if you can just maybe share a little bit of your background, why you're speaking here today, and kind of some of the feedback that you've had from the summit so far. Sure. My background, I'm a farm kid from Illinois, grew up on a corn and bean farm there, but I've been in Washington, DC for the last 20 years working on ag policy issues. Uh, right now I'm actually with a small consulting firm that does all ag and food policy work. One of our clients is Michigan Corn Growers. Um, we also do some work for the crop insurance industry.

So I've been here talking about, uh, crop insurance and talking specifically about farm policy in DC these days. So let's jump into the crop insurance. It's, uh, maybe sometimes controversial topic for some people, maybe hard to understand. You know, what exactly do you deal in with that? And you know, what can it do for the farmers and the producers out there? Yeah, sure. So my first speech today was actually a little bit of a Crop Insurance 101, just to talk to some of those folks that maybe have questions about the basics of crop insurance or to talk about to folks who maybe don't purchase crop insurance at all, a little bit about what some of those benefits can be. And it always comes with a disclaimer that anytime we talk about crop insurance that folks should be sure to go talk to their crop insurance agent. The details do matter in crop insurance.

And sort of the upside and downside of crop insurance is that the programs are really flexible. Lots of different options for farmers to find some, some type of risk management tool that works for their farm individually. The downside, of course, is that that makes the program pretty complicated, and it really does require a really good agent to walk folks through that decision-making process. So I was wondering if maybe you can paint a picture out there. What does it look like with farm operations for those that do have crop insurance versus those that don't or those that are sporadic? You know, what does that look like kind of across the country? Yeah. So crop insurance coverage overall, crop insurance is very popular. We see really high coverage levels by and large. I think we're up to about 300 million acres of cropland covered by crop insurance now.

And also the vast majority of crop acres in the United States are now covered by crop insurance. Not all of them, but a lot of them are covered these days. And it's interesting, a lot of the producers that we work with with Ag View Solutions, you know, are great about having the coverage, having the insurance, making sure that they're protected and even going up and beyond to the max limits that they can because they realize the importance and, you know, what that expense is. Relative to the overall cost of production, how that ties in. No other line item on your expense sheet can really guarantee the amount of production and the amount of revenue, you know, in the event of a catastrophe or something else happening. But I know there are people out there that look at crop insurance and they're like, wow, you know, that's a, that's a big expense year in and year out.

And I haven't made a claim in this long. And, you know, how do I continue to contribute money to that? Do you see that changing at all? Um, you know, on a large scale, I mean, obviously acreage coverage is up, but how are some of those decisions being made when we've seen pretty sideways profit margins here for the last 5 or 6 years? Absolutely. So I think years like 2012 with the drought and even this last year with all of the flooding sort of helped make the case for crop insurance and why it's important. Certainly, um, I know back in Illinois, farmers often pay into crop insurance and, uh, don't see a claim for a decade at a time. Um, but boy, when they do have that claim, uh, it can make or break the farm. So I think it's years like that that sort of help make the case.

I think something else that's really changed over the years is that you're starting to see a lot of ag lenders, if not outright require the purchase of crop insurance, strongly encourage it. And I think that we're seeing that trend continue. As farmers start to feel some of the financial stress of the last, the last few years. The good news is there are some options out there that can help decrease that crop insurance bill, whether it's moving to enterprise units or whether it's looking at supplemental coverage options instead of just all optional or basic units. You have some tools available to you that can help reduce that bill but still give you some coverage that you need. So let's talk a little bit about that flexibility, because on the number of acres and the differences in operations, you have to have a dynamic, um, solution to some of those problems.

And that's where the flexibility in those confusion comes in. So can you talk to that just a little bit on why that flexibility is so important? Yeah, every farm is different. So to have a one-size-fits-all option for something as important as crop insurance is just impossible. And so one of the goals of the program really since 2000 has been to be as flexible as, as possible and to make crop insurance as big of a tent as possible so that every farmer can find a risk management solution that works for them and their individual farm and their individual situation. Again, the downside of that, um, is that that means you got a lot of options to weed through. It can be confusing, and you really need to be sure you have a good crop insurance agent to walk you through those options, right?

And I know that is another thing that we look at too, is if you're not happy with your crop insurance agent, it's turned a lot of people off over the years, or, you know, just kind of given a negative connotation to some people. And I You know, that's certainly not the majority, but it is important to make sure that you're working with the right person and that they are taking everything under their wing to try and, you know, care for you and protect your operation as well. That is absolutely right. I mean, the beauty of the public-private partnership that is crop insurance is that farmers do have a choice. It's not like your FSA office where you have one office you can go to and you don't have any choice.

If you have an agent that is isn't working for you or isn't giving you the options you need, or if you have a company that hasn't provided the service that you need or demand, you, you can take your business elsewhere. So, you know, if folks have had bad experiences in the past, I hope they'll take another look at crop insurance, find another agent. There is an agent locator actually on the RMA website at the USDA website that can help you find an agent nearby if you just don't even know where to look. Now, that's great information. I appreciate you sharing that resource too, because I know some people don't know that. Um, you know, let's shift here kind of as we wrap things up. Talk a little bit— I know your second session was on policy and politics and kind of what's going on bigger picture and how that affects.

And, you know, you said it is a little quiet in there as far as people maybe not wanting to voice their opinion or ask questions. But, you know, what are some of those questions being asked? What's going on right now? And where do you see that moving forward? Yeah, I mean, we've really seen sort of farm policy in addition to the farm economy sort of turned on its head these last couple of years. We had gone almost a dozen years without an ad hoc disaster assistance package. We've had ad hoc disaster assistance the last 2 years. We've seen trade aid payments, tens of billions of dollars in sort of off-books payments payments going to farmers that aren't part of the traditional farm safety net, which of course always raises questions about the farm safety net that exists and what isn't working and what do we need to do to fix it.

It also draws a lot of, a lot of attention to farm policy and to the money that's going out the door to farmers. Thankfully, you know, we're not in a Farm Bill year right now, but it's only going to be about 2 more years when we need to start thinking about defending the Farm Bill and defending crop insurance and, and other farm programs from cuts. And so a lot of the talk was just around what some of the criticisms are that we could face, uh, coming down the pike given where we've been on farm policy the last 2 years.

Right, certainly a lot changing in the industry, and it's hard to believe that that's coming around the corner here again already, but it's, it's so important and it's so crucial for the livelihood of many people out there that we defend, you know, some of the programs or some of the, you know, the purpose of why they are there to make sure that we are protected for what we're doing. Absolutely. And there are folks that, you know, will always be our opposition on those issues. Folks like Heritage Foundation, Environmental Working Group. I mean, these are folks that year after year make a point of coming coming after farm policy broadly, but after crop insurance specifically.

And so just finding a way to be sure that we as an industry and as the farming community are starting to gear up for those fights, get our talking points dusted off, and be sure they're the right talking points to defend the program moving forward. Great. Is there anything else that you wanted to hit on here, you know, before we, before we wrap things up that you think is important for the listeners to know? Well, just that I hope everyone has a little bit calmer year this coming year than they did, than they did last year. We don't need another year like last year. So just well wishes for a good planting season. I think everybody is in the same boat with you there and appreciate the well wishes on this end. Well, Tara, it's been a pleasure. Thank you so much for joining us here today. Thanks for having me. And thank you everyone for listening.

Shay

Foulk: We will catch you next time on the Ag View Pitch.

Unknown: Thanks for joining us on today's episode of the EggView Pitch.

Shay

Foulk: As always, you can reach out to us at cbarron@agviewsolutions.com or duanel@netins.net. We'll catch you next time on the EggView Pitch.